We have a Gallup Poll that says Americans mostly don't know Obama's religion.
from Political Wire:
Meanwhile, Americans are more likely to know Mitt Romney's religion, with most Americans correctly saying Romney is a Mormon and a smaller 33% saying they don't know.
We have Warren Jeffress and others claiming that being a Mormon means you belong to a cult. And it is not just Jeffress but a cross section of Christians who claim Mormonism is NOT Christian.
We have a significant percentage of southern conservatives who believe that mixed marriages between people of different races, the technical term is miscegenation, should be illegal - and of course, President Obama is bi-racial. Conservative surrogates are calling him Un-american, an old tired tirade that Michele Bachmann wore out, gaining her long term contempt from everyone except hard core right wing extremists.
from Political Wire:
Most Don't Know Obama's Religion
A new Gallup poll finds that just 34% of Americans know that President Obama is Christian, while 11% say he's Muslim and 44% don't know.Meanwhile, Americans are more likely to know Mitt Romney's religion, with most Americans correctly saying Romney is a Mormon and a smaller 33% saying they don't know.
We have Warren Jeffress and others claiming that being a Mormon means you belong to a cult. And it is not just Jeffress but a cross section of Christians who claim Mormonism is NOT Christian.
We have a significant percentage of southern conservatives who believe that mixed marriages between people of different races, the technical term is miscegenation, should be illegal - and of course, President Obama is bi-racial. Conservative surrogates are calling him Un-american, an old tired tirade that Michele Bachmann wore out, gaining her long term contempt from everyone except hard core right wing extremists.
So it should be no surprise that the typically conservative southern Baptists needed to flex a little racism, to..... you know, keep those uppity black Americans in their subordinate, submissive place. It should be noted, there was no objection to this couple for any other reason, any belief, any behavior, conduct or action that offened on their part. It was purely because of their race and ethnicity.
And the right wonders why the rest of us think many conservatives (not all) are racist? THIS is just one example of why. Nationally, we are better than we were, but we are not there yet -- and most of that problem is from conservatives.
from Opposing Views:
White Church Blocks Black Wedding of Charles and Te’Andrea Wilson
By Michael Allen, Fri, July 27, 2012
In Crystal Springs, Mississippi, Charles and Te’Andrea Wilson, who are black, told WLBT-TV that the day before their wedding, Dr. Stan Weatherford, of the First Baptist Church of Crystal Springs, said their ceremony would have to be moved because some white church members were offended (video below).
Charles Wilson said: “The church congregation had decided no black could be married at that church, and that if [the pastor] went on to marry her, then they would vote him out the church.”
Te’Andrea Wilson added: “He had people in the sanctuary that were pitching a fit about us being a black couple. I didn’t like it at all, because I wasn’t brought up to be racist. I was brought up to love and care for everybody.”
Dr. Weatherford gave into his racist church members and performed the marriage at another church: “This had never been done before here, so it was setting a new precedent, and there are those who reacted to that because of that."
"I didn’t want to have a controversy within the church, and I didn’t want a controversy to affect the wedding of Charles and Te’ Andrea. I wanted to make sure their wedding day was a special day.”
Charles Wilson said: “The church congregation had decided no black could be married at that church, and that if [the pastor] went on to marry her, then they would vote him out the church.”
Te’Andrea Wilson added: “He had people in the sanctuary that were pitching a fit about us being a black couple. I didn’t like it at all, because I wasn’t brought up to be racist. I was brought up to love and care for everybody.”
Dr. Weatherford gave into his racist church members and performed the marriage at another church: “This had never been done before here, so it was setting a new precedent, and there are those who reacted to that because of that."
"I didn’t want to have a controversy within the church, and I didn’t want a controversy to affect the wedding of Charles and Te’ Andrea. I wanted to make sure their wedding day was a special day.”
I wonder how many of these Obama-is-a-Muslim, anti-miscegenation, no black people marrying in our church, evolution disbelieving old white people also believe that homosexuals are child molesters? Demonize one group, it is easy to demonize everyone with whom you disagree from the right. You just start by totally ignoring anything factual, claim moral high ground, and hate hate hate. You can't do it without that fundamental, fundamentalist conservative ignorance.
Dog- I do not claim to be Christian, nor like minded to Mr. Jeffress, but I do wonder if Mormonism is a cult. Hear me out.
ReplyDeleteI am an agnostic, but I do like learning about different religions. I ask questions a lot. I especially find that Buddists and Jews are very accepting of questions, and more than happy to answer. Just about every question I've ever had for someone revolving around their religion, was answered. Accept for Mormons. If you ask a Mormon certain questions about their religion, they will politely decline to answer. Then they will tell you that they can answer, IF you come to their church. I don't know about you, but that sounds a little cultish to me.
J.O.B. - this depends on how you define a cult, doesn't it? Is being secretive the definitive quality, or a core quality of that definition?
ReplyDeleteBy that definition, scientiology could be defined as a cult as well. Good ol' wikipedia comes to the definition rescue, making distinctions between cults and sects. Curiously, our modern use of the term cult doesn't really go back that far - early 20th century.
If you look at Christianity, it was originally considered a 'cult' or sect within Judaism in the first couple of centuries back in the 'common era' aka early AD or just pre-AD (anno domini).
I think the sense that most of us have of cult refers to the degree of domination and isolation associated with negative qualities like mind control, involving coercive persuasion (again per wikipedia):
Studies have identified a number of key steps in coercive persuasion:[17][18]
1.People are put in physically or emotionally distressing situations;
2.Their problems are reduced to one simple explanation, which is repeatedly emphasized;
3.They receive what seems to be unconditional love, acceptance, and attention from a charismatic leader or group;
4.They get a new identity based on the group;
5.They are subject to entrapment (isolation from friends, relatives and the mainstream culture) and their access to information is severely controlled.[19]
Some religions have had their secrets, mysteries, whatever over a period of millenia (not the same ones usually of course, they come and go).
I don't know Dog. It's just weird, when I think of religious people, I think they should be celebrating and rejoicing in their religion. I would also think they would want to share their beliefs with someone who is inquisitive. I'm not saying Mormons are like the Manson Family, or that crazy Jim Jones dude from the 70's. I was just taken aback by that Mormon dudes answer to a few basic questions that I had.
DeleteIf you follow the link above in the sentence which mentions Jefferess, the link about Mormons being accused of not being Christian, this is significant:When someone says Mormons aren't Christian... he or she usually means that Mormons don't embrace the traditional interpretation of the Bible that includes the Trinity. "Our Jesus" is somehow different from "their Jesus." Further, they mean that some Mormon teachings are so far outside Christian orthodoxy of past centuries that they constitute almost a new religion. and "Christianity" is not based on what you say about yourself or your beliefs. "Christianity" must be connected to how your beliefs agree with the beliefs of biblical Christianity.
ReplyDeleteYes, Moromonism has a lot of beliefs outside of Old Worlde Christianity; so what? The old world schisms are pretty deep too. We have the RC / eastern Christianity schism, the south of the mediterranean schism, the protestant / RC schism.
We have versions of Christianity that assert the pope is the anit-christ - some of them pretty darn mainstream. I grew up with my Catholic friends telling me that they heard at home and church that if they married one of us Lutherans when we grew up, they'd burn in hell; that was just as popular.
We self-identify our religious affiliation - or lack of one. The article is wrong; no one else, including other religions, same or different, get to do that for us. The only maybe I would insert into that is on a purely academic basis for some kind of categorizing basis, a religious or thoeological sort of taxonomy for other than worship purposes.
Sam Harris, the author, wrote some amazing things about the distinction between spirituality, particularly in eastern religions, and our formal western religions. I commend people to read his works on the topic of religion generally. I would add to that the distinction between superstition and spirituatlity, and the interesection of religion to those two very different things.